HomeMy WebLinkAboutMIN 11.08.2011 CC-WThe City Council of the City of Georgetown, Texas, met in Regular Session on the above date with Mayor
George Garver presiding.
Council Present: Council Absent:
Patty Eason, Danny Meigs, Bill Sattler, Pat All Council Present
Berryman, Tommy Gonzalez, Rachael Jonrowe,
Troy Hellmann
Stmt Present:
Paul E. Brandenburg, City Manager; Bridget Chapman, Acting City Attorney; Jessica Brettle, City
Secretary; Edward Polasek, Transportation Services Director; Micki Rundell, Chief Financial Officer;
Wayne Nero, Police Chief;
Minutes
A Discussion and possible direction to staff on possible impacts of 2010 Census Urbanized Area Designations on
State and Federal Transit Funding -- Ed Polasek, Transportation Services Director, and Micki Rundell, Chief
Financial Officer
Gonzalez absent.
With a Powerpoint Presentation, Polasek discussed the Census designations and its effect on state and federal
transit funding. He said the urban area designations will be released in 2012 and could change Georgetown's
designation from rural to urban. He said TXDOT has taken the initiative to help fund a TTI study of potential
urbanized areas and to work with those communities on what that designation will mean. He noted this will have
a budget impact in 2012 if CARTS is no longer functioning in Georgetown. He said this item will be taken to the
Georgetown Transportation Advisory Board, but they wanted to bring this to Council for an initial overview. He
said we just want to have a chance to give an update on where we are in the process.
He introduced Meredith Highsmith of Texas Transportation Institute (TTI) to the City Council. Highsmith said she
is an assistant research scientist with the Transit Mobility Program of TTI, a division of Texas A&M University
that specializes in transportation research. She said she is here to present to Council information on the census
2010 for funding for transit for the City. She said said of the items to discuss are the current transit services,
possible outcomes of the 2010 census, the impact of this on transit and next steps. Highsmith described the
current transit services offered in Georgetown. She said CARTS is offering all of the transit services in
Georgetown. She said the estimated annual 2012 operating cost of CARTS is $400,400. She said the CARTS
regional connections are interurban and para -transit within the city and from city to city. She said the CARTS
Georgetown station opened in 2010 and she spoke about their annual cost of operating that station. She
provided Council with an example of the current service CARTS provides. She showed Council the yellow route,
or the interurban route, along 1-35. She said this service serves Georgetown, Round Rock, Austin and San
Marcos out of the new Georgetown station. Jonrowe asked and Highsmith said these are CARTS scheduled
times. She said she would have to defer to Edna Johnson of CARTS in terms of times and why those were
chosen. Highsmith showed Council a map demonstrating the current CARTS para -transit trips being utilized in
the City of Georgetown. She showed Council the destination locations by trip purpose. She said she wanted to
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point out on both of these maps that, across the board, there is not one segment of the population that is being
served more than others. She spoke about the current sources of funding for CARTS. She said Georgetown is
part of CARTS rural transit district. She spoke about the significance of the 2010 population moving forward.
She said the federal transportation funding is based on most recent census. She spoke about the US census
schedule. She said in April of 2011, block level population data was released for use in redistricting. She said
in August 2011, the census released their final say on the 2010 urban area criteria. She said in the Spring of
2012, the urbanized areas are going to be reported by the Census. She said in terms of the urban area
designations, the FTA has two major designations, an urbanized area and a rural area. She said there are
different funding levels in each one of these breakdowns. She spoke about the determination of the urbanized
areas. She said it is based on the 2010 census, determined by the US census bureau, calculations using
defined urban criteria by computer analysis of census tracts and census blocks with uniform application of rules.
She spoke about jump connections and impervious surface. She showed Council a map of the projected 2010
census outcomes. She noted this is TTI's best guess. She showed Council a map of the zoomed in section of
the area on 35 south of Georgetown. She said, on the previous map, Georgetown is 2.55 miles away from the
next urbanized area (Round Rock). She said there are two scenarios for the 2010 census, scenario 1(small
urban area) or scenario 2 (part of a large urban area). She described the eligible sources of funds for transit
under each of those scenarios. She showed Council a decision tree of what would occur after the census
urbanized area results are released under both scenarios and designations. She spoke about the options for
governance and operating service under both scenarios. She said they did their best to estimate what funding
Georgetown could potentially receive. She said scenario one is the most likely scenario and said, under that
scenario,the City could be a direct recipient of the FTA Section 5307 Urbanized formula funds. She spoke
about state funding under scenario one and how Georgetown can become a recipient of the Texas transit
funding. She showed Council an example of a financial plan for the current service in scenario one. She said
some of the things to consider are the census designations, federal bills, the metropolitan planning process and
the local share requirements. She spoke about next steps and said they are following the census
announcements closely and how that will effect the City and discuss options available to Georgetown.
Mayor asked and Highsmith said, if Georgetown becomes a small urban area, it will need to make a decision on
whether or not to proceed with transit service. She said since Georgetown would be an urban area and CARTS
is a rural provider, Georgetown would stand to lose CARTS service. She said the City will need to proceed with
how to move forward with this issue. She said the Council needs to be prepared to make a decision for how to
proceed with the future of transit services for the City. Sattler asked and Highsmith said, once this comes out in
April 2012, the turnaround to make a decision is very quick. Sattler asked and Polasek said the City intends to
go to the GTAB Board with these scenarios and see what their recommendations will be. Polasek said, if the
City loses CARTS service, the Council will need to decide how to proceed. Sattler asked and Polasek said
Round Rock has CARTS service but only through contracts. Sattler asked and Edna Johnson, the
Communications Director of CARTS, said Round Rock contracts with them for the service. She said, in 2000,
Round Rock became an urban area and decided to contract with CARTS and pay the fully allocated cost for that
service. She said San Marcos is still considered rural and will also most likely be urban in the Spring as well.
Sattler asked and Johnson confirmed they can bring the costs of going into a contract to the Council at a later
date. Meigs asked and Polasek confirmed it is to the City's advantage to be a small urban area, or scenario
one. Polasek described why it is to the City's benefit. Meigs asked and Polasek said the odds are 80/20 that the
City will be designated as a small urban area. Berryman asked and Highsmith said the total population amount
is calculated based on the urbanized area and not just the City limits. Mayor asked and Highsmith explained
why the portion south of the City and above Round Rock is important to the City's designation. Hellmann asked
and Highsmith confirmed this designation changes every ten years after each new census.Hellmann asked and
Highsmith said the City could potentially have its own urban system if the City does away with CARTS.
Hellmann asked and Highsmith said the annexations and city limits will not effect this at all. Hellmann asked
and Johnson spoke about what would happen with the station if the City no longer uses CARTS. Eason asked if
there is a way to submit comments to the census about this decision. Highsmith said no and that the City will
have no say on the census determination. There were many questions about possible future funding
scenarios. Berryman asked about the cost of operating the City's own service and how it fits together with all of
this. Polasek said the original pilot program for transit was $500,000 for six fixed routes. He said these new
options would replace different type of services an would be separate from a pilot program. Mayor spoke about
the City's advisory committees that are able to vet out these issues for further and more in depth discussion.
Eason asked and Polasek confirmed all of these issues will be going to GTAB for full discussion and then
council will see it again at a later date.
B Discussion and possible direction to staff regarding the public safety facility -- Wayne Nero, Police Chief and
Paul E. Brandenburg, City Manager
Mayor introduced the item and described the process to be used for the discussion. With a Powerpoint
Presentation, Brandenburg gave an overview of the past action on the public safety facility. He spoke about how
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Brinkley Sargeant came in and did a space needs study for public safety in 2008. He spoke about how the
Council bought the Albertson's building for use as a new facility. He added, in 2010, the decision was made to
look at land somewhere else for a new facility instead. He said on November 23, 2010, the Council appointed a
task force to research this issue. He said, from that, a recommendation was made to the City Council. He said
City Council then took that to the voters in May of 2011 and the bond passed. He said a decision needs to be
made on what the Council wants to do with moving forward with this facility. .
Nero spoke about the current space the police department inhabits.
Gonzalez arrived at the dais.
He said the main space they are in today is 9,700 square feet, the annex is 2,500 square feet and the
Georgetown Communications and Training (GCAT) building is 7,500 feet. He said a space needs assessment
was done by Brinkley Sargeant Architects and said the original assessment was done in 2007. He said an
additional assessment was done and the new numbers provided to staff in 2010 was 46,000 in 2020 and 50,000
square feet in 2030. He continued to speak about the 2010 needs assessment. He said there was a shift to a
public safety model which would encompass the space needs for both police and fire as well as training. He
said, under this new model, the current need is at 54,000, the 2020 projected need is 62,000 and the 2030 need
is 69,000. He shifted gears and spoke about training needs and how a new facility would be utilized. He showed
Council a video of some of the trainings that occur for police officers in the current program. He spoke about
the scenario that is given to each of the officers prior to the training course. He said it is important to show the
difference in the two responses from officers, one that is not used to this type of training and another that is from
a professional background. He continued to describe the video. He spoke about the training facility and how the
new facility would offer the officers a good opportunity for more advanced training. He showed Council a video
to demonstrate this. He said the tactical building is a steel building, has updated technology and it allows
officers to do full spectrum training. He said right now we do not do as much tactical training as the City needs
because it does not have the suitable facilities.
Brandenburg staff is asking for direction from Council and added there are five options for Council to consider.
He said option one, which is the bond approval of voters, is 70,0000 square feet ($250 per sq/ft), cost of
between $17,500,00 and $20,000,0000, with $1,250,000 for furniture and fixtures. He said option two is a down
sized facility with future add-on space. He said this would total 50,000 square feet, cost between $12.5 million
and $15 million. He said the other 20,000 square feet will be built on as needed. He said option three is to the
use the Albertson's building, which is 55,684 square feet. He said it would be $10,412,908 for renovations to
make it usable by the police and fire. He siad with this option, the training component would go away. He said
option four is to use the old library, which is 17,000 square feet, and a cost of $1.6 million to renovate. He said
the issue is the police department will grow out of this space quickly.
Rundell spoke about costs and the estimated tax impacts of each option based on the 2011 assessed
valuations. She said option one, which is the full facility, would be up to $20 million or $0.04871 on the tax rate
with a 25 year bond. She showed option two, which is a phased facility and is up to $15 million or $0.0357 on
the tax rate. She spoke about option three for the Albertson's Building and said it is up to $12.50 million or a little
over $0.030 on the tax rate..She spoke about option four and said it would cost up to $3.75 million or $0.00806
on the tax rate. Brandenburg said there is potential for Council to take action tonight and noted there is an action
item on the regular agenda as well. Gonzalez asked and Rundell said there is no net gain to the City on the sale
of the Albertson's building. Hellmann asked and Nero said the steel training building is separate from the needs
of the main building. Sattler asked and Rundell said the $2.5 million would fund the design and any leftovers
would go toward the project. Sattler asked and Rundell said the $2.5 million of bonds would sell this May. She
said in the event we would do the entire amount, the City may want to do it all at the same time due to market
conditions. She said the market is good right now and it would be an additional $1 million to wait a year. She
said the latest she could issue those bonds is March or April and added a current Council can not encumber a
future Council unless the fiscal and budgetary policy is amended. Eason asked and Fite said option two still
includes the immediate need for the Fire Administration. Hellmann asked about the $250 per square foot cost
and Brandenburg said that number came from the original survey from Brinkley Sargeant as well as the
averages for other facilities around Texas that have recently been built. Brandenburg said $250 is actually on
the higher, more conservative end in terms of cost.
Gonzalez asked and Rundell said a full cost analysis will be done before bonds are issued. She said the main
question will be what the gain is if the city issues all of the bonds at once. Gonzalez said it does not look like
rates are going to budge until into 2013. Rundell said she would recommend issuing the bonds in the Fall of
next year if she were to decide today. She said the staff will do a lot of analysis in that determination before
making a recommendation on this. She added the City can talk about how to fund the project once Council
decides on which option they want. Jonrowe asked and Rundell said the rates will decrease over time as the
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assessed valuation for the City grows. Rundell said this is a conservative projection.
Sattler asked what the Chiefs would lose with a downsized facility. Nero said it would not affect training but
added it will just affect space. Mayor asked and Jones said his responsibility is to construct this facility. Sattler
asked and Jones said he feels comfortable with the $250 per square foot rate being used for the cost estimates.
Jones noted in the approval item later tonight the numbers are a little less. He added he thinks it could be done
for less than that. Sattler asked if the City moves quicker, do we get better economies of scale. Jones said he
does not think so and added it will be some time before the public safety facility is completed. Brandenburg
summarized the timeline for construction of the new fire station and the public safety facility. Sattler asked and
Fite said he feels option two would provide the department with large enough facilities to use.
Sattler asked and Fite said when he and Nero visited five cities, all of the cities told them to build for growth. He
noted the City will save millions in the future by planning for growth now. Mayor asked and Brandenburg
explained how the public safety department can grow into a space if a facility is built out for 50,000 square feet
with an extra 20,000 square feet as just a shell. Hellmann asked and Jones confirmed that would be a hybrid
approach. Hellmann asked and Fite said McKinney was a good example and noted they are 85,000 square
feet. He said they reinforced the roof to where they would be able to add a floor on to it in the future as well.
Hellmann asked and staff said we would not be able to take their plans and build the same thing. Fite said,
however, the City can repeat some of the elements of those best facilities in our RFQ. Sattler asked and Jones
said we are ready for summer 2014 if we start now. Jones said the Council approved the construction delivery
method back in August. Eason asked about the possible advantage of going with option two. Nero said once of
the challenges with this is that each of the spaces for a public safety facility are different. He spoke about how
each room in a facility is different.
Rundell addressed the cost differences between option one and two. She said the difference in tax is about a
penny. She noted she would recommend doing a 25 year bond with this because it is a 25 year facility. She
said option two reduces the tax burden but is a greater cost for the City in the long run. Rundell said tonight's
item is to move forward with the $2.5 million bond reimbursement resolution which would allow the City to move
forward with the architectural design. She said the City will still have options one and two open at that point.
Gonzalez asked and Jones said the City has the option to either go up or out with a building that could be
expanded upon. Jones said you are going to be paying a large up front cost to finish out a building. Berryman
said no one has brought up the Albertson's building discussion. She said she wants to bring it up and said this
would be a good use for it and she does not see any potential buyers out there. She said she is concerned
about letting it just set there. She said she is also concerned about making such a rash decision. She noted it
seems Council is gravitating to option two. She said Council is just hearing about this tonight and added she
would like to defer this decision until a later meeting. Mayor said the postponement of an item is up to Council.
Gonzalez said his understanding is that the agenda item later on is for just the architectural design of the facility.
Berryman disagrees and said if the Council goes with option three, then they will not need the design at all.
Hellmann asked and Brandenburg said the city could ask a developer to build what they can with $14 million but
noted he would not recommend it. Brandenburg said it is going on almost five years that the Albertson's has
been empty space. He reviewed the decisions that had made in the past regarding this building.
Berryman said she would like to defer this decision until next meeting. She said she appreciates looking at the
amount of money being spent. She spoke about the economic downturn in the country. She said she would
leave it up to our discretion. She said they would like to look at this further now that we have numbers. Eason
said her understanding of the vote is something we must do because of the issuance of bonds. She said she
thinks the work that has been done on this had been going on for years and added she is not going to go back
to the arguments concerning the Albertson's and the Old Library. She said those options are not fair to either
the citizens or to our safety personnel to pursue the Albertson's building as an option. She said, between
options one or two, she would like to pursue the cost fully because she is hearing that it is not a significant
savings to go with option two. She said she favors going with option one and said option two is inadequate
because the current needs are already for more of the 50,000 square feet proposed in this option. She said she
is going to support that we make a decision and added we should not wait any longer. She said she is ready to
go forward with this. Gonzalez said, looking at the options, options three and four are just not viable. He said he
does have some leanings toward option two and added 50,000 will probably be adequate. He said that would
lower the costs to the residents of Georgetown and added he hopes that growth would help to keep the tax rates
low. He said he would like to continue to look at things globally. He said he has no problem moving forward
with a drawing and then go with either options one or two. Hellmann said he thinks public safety is one of the
most important things and added he moved here because it is a safe place to live. He noted, at the same time,
we have to be careful with how much we spend. He said he also moved his family here because there is a low
tax rate. He noted he likes option two better than option three because it keeps Albertson's on the tax rolls. He
said it is a similar tax impact if you look at the numbers. He said he would rather have something we can expand
on and therefore he likes option two. He said he likes the idea of a hybrid between option one and two where
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the can build out a certain amount and then leave a shell for another portion of the building. He said, to even
know the answer to that, the City will have to hire an architect. He said hopefully the city does not spend the
entire $2.5 million on an architect. He said he is hoping the City receives a reduction of cost and noted he is
looking for a hybrid scenario.
Jonrowe thanked Chief Fite and Chief Nero for spending so much time doing the groundwork for all of this. She
said she also wants to say that she took a full tour of the police facility yesterday and one of the things that
struck her was the phrase that they "make it work." She noted she likes Sattler's idea of a hybrid option of the
space where the city finishes out the 50,000 square feet and then has a shell for the rest of the 20,000 square
feet ready to go. She said the department's needs may change and added it may be good not to build out
completely. She agreed with moving forward to getting the architect going. Meigs said he agrees with Hellmann
that public safety is the number one concern and said we are blessed with great leadership. He said our current
space is inadequate. He noted he has confidence in the voters in Georgetown and added they knew what they
were voting on with this facility. He said he thinks we need to move forward with this with either options one or
two. Sattler thanked the chiefs for their work and added public safety and health is the most important thing in
our City. He said options four and five should not be considered. He noted he has a concern with option three
and cost. Rundell said the City has already bought the building and confirmed we are already paying debt on
that building. Sattler said he sees the main choice is between options one and two. He said his concern is the
tax impact we are giving to our voters. He said he thinks that when you look at Rundell's estimates, it is
conservative and he likes that. He said options one or two are good but noted he leans toward option two with a
hybrid.
Mayor asked and Rundell said the City will eventually sell bonds in May like the City normally does for the hiring
of the architect. Berryman asked and Rundell said deferring this for another two weeks will not impact the City
one way or another. Rundell said the concern is to hire the architect in order to keep in line with Jones'
schedule. Mayor asked and Rundell said she will do her best to get Council a number for a hybrid option later
on at the regular meeting. Berryman she would be interested in seeing the costs and effect of a hybrid option
of prepping the building for future expansion. Fite said option two is exactly that. Nero said if we had to do
option two, we would have the building engineered and design so that we are able to expand at a later date if we
need to do so. He said the hybrid brought up by some of the Council members sounds like it would be to build
to 70,000 square feet but only finish out 50,000 square feet. Sattler asked if we could spread this bond issue
out. He asked when we would start selling the $12.5 million. Rundell spoke about her recommendation for this
and added the City can do this all at once or determine to do a bond every year as cash is dispensed. She said
this is dependent on market conditions because there is market risk. She recommended the City still go forward
with the issuance of the $2.5 million bonds for architectural services.
Mayor said it seems like Council would like to see the hybrid option at a future date. He asked Council about
what they would like to see transpire. Hellmann said the only advantage of waiting is if option three was an
option and, if the council likes option one or two, they can still move forward with the architectural bonds. He
said we can always make a decision of options one, two, or a hybrid at a later date. Meigs said he thinks it is
important to get the architect going so council knows what the costs are. Mayor said the architect will need to
know which option is being built before true costs can be laid out. Berryman said her desire to wait until the next
meeting is so she can get with her constituents to see what they thought. She noted this decision will effect
their taxes in a big way. Gonzalez said if the city finishes out a shell, the city will still need to maintain that shell.
He noted he is coming from an all or nothing perspective. Sattler asked and Rundell said she will be able to
answer his questions at another time. Sattler said he is very interested in how we could finance this with the
least amount of impact on the tax payer. There was much discussion on whether to vote on this issue now or
later.
Motion by Berryman, second by Eason to direct staff to come back to Council at the next meeting with
definitive numbers on the hybrid option and a definition of exactly what that will be and to come back with all
costs for options one, two and the hybrid option for consideration and approval at that time.
Rundell said these are all estimates and she said they will be giving Council an estimate on what those total
costs would be. She said she likes Berryman's idea of coming back at a later date so she can provide Council
with better numbers. There were many questions about this issue.
Vote on the motion: Approved 7-0
Council recessed to Executive Session under Section 551.071-- 5:25 PM
Council returned to Open Session and adjourned -- 6:06 PM
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Appr
Mayor G orge Garver
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Adjournment
The meeting was adjourned at 06:06 PM.